Wiki leak

[IAN 2411]

90,000 leaked documents what a fuck up on the US Governments part, pure blatant stupidity. Don’t think for one minute that I am running down the USA because I am not, I am running down their security.

If you have been living in the land of [we don’t do that] then wake up. Get in the real world and get a life and with it knowledge. If you think that the west don’t commit atrocities then i have news for you? The only reason the UK and the USA and Russia were not in the war trials after WW11 for atrocities is because we won the war. Viet Nam well we all know about the war crimes there, killing children, and throwing live personnel out of helicopters at 1000 feet up in the air [FACT].

Northern Ireland, the crimes are still being looked at now, [Bloody Sunday] one of them. Aden [RadFan]. Cyprus, i don’t know the name but UK Army in the Pan Handle, EOKA civilians, [Firing squad].

I am afraid that the Afghan people don’t get my sympathy and never will, if civilians were shot then there is more than likely a reason. One other point, just who are the civilians and who are the Taliban? They are a nation of fighting people that can’t get on with themselves, and the ones we train to look after their country kill our troops, and i can understand both USA and UK troop’s anger at being betrayed by them. Killing for the sake of killing i think that there is more to the story than that, but no doubt that this website will twist all the words.

I am stunned that an Australian person can simply divulge this information to the world, and I believe that WikiLeak.org is www trash.

My thoughts on this, The USA have got to go to print and piss on the WikaLeak.org fireworks before they light the fuse.

Words fail me.

Regards ian 2411

[Thorne]

I'm of two minds about this whole mess.

On the one hand, tearing away the veils of secrecy which have protected the politicians, high-ranking military and businessmen from having to account for their stupidity, greed and outright lies, can't be anything but a good thing in the long run. Far too many things are declared Top Secret not to protect sources or pending actions but to cover up the mistakes and bad choices made by our leaders.

On the other hand, such a massive leak is bound to cause serious problems for the soldiers on the ground trying to stay alive while fighting this stupid war. Sometimes, revealing information can point directly at how and when that information was obtained, which can point to agents in place, risking their lives and any future information they might gain.

Balancing these two points is tricky, but wholesale leaks are bound to cause far more damage to the soldiers than to their leaders. As for the deaths of innocent civilians and children, it's a sad fact of war that such deaths are going to happen. When the civilians are aiding our enemies they become valid targets. But even if they are not, it's impossible to fight a war without some mistakes being made.

The type of war being fought here, as in Viet Nam, is primarily a guerrilla war, where the enemy strikes and fades back into the civilian population. Like a surgeon facing a gangrenous wound, it's sometimes necessary to lop off a leg in order to save the body. It's brutal, it's unfair, but it's necessary. One of the horrors of war.

[DuncanONeil]

90,000 leaked documents what a fuck up on the US Governments part, pure blatant stupidity. Don’t think for one minute that I am running down the USA because I am not, I am running down their security.

It is hard to run down security when a person with access takes it upon themselves to purloin stuff. May not occur, or we may not hear but it would be interesting to hear the reasons the material was stolen.

If you have been living in the land of [we don’t do that] then wake up. Get in the real world and get a life and with it knowledge. If you think that the west don’t commit atrocities then i have news for you? The only reason the UK and the USA and Russia were not in the war trials after WW11 for atrocities is because we won the war. Viet Nam well we all know about the war crimes there, killing children, and throwing live personnel out of helicopters at 1000 feet up in the air [FACT].

There is still a lot of room for misunderstanding about Vietnam. However the issue of children is one that should be touched on. It is also a know fact of Vietnam that children were used as actives in that war. One instance that was reported to me was of a child of about 12 that approached a check point. Directed to stop and raise hands, did not stop and only raised hands by bending arms at elbow. Redirected to stop and raise hands a number of times. When close enough the child finally raised their arms, dropping two live grenades from their armpits. You see this what do you do the next time?

I am afraid that the Afghan people don’t get my sympathy and never will, if civilians were shot then there is more than likely a reason. One other point, just who are the civilians and who are the Taliban? They are a nation of fighting people that can’t get on with themselves, and the ones we train to look after their country kill our troops, and i can understand both USA and UK troop’s anger at being betrayed by them. Killing for the sake of killing i think that there is more to the story than that, but no doubt that this website will twist all the words.

Then you turn around and recognize the very kind of behaviour as seen in Vietnam as acceptable reasons for "civilian" casualties? Makes for a confusing understanding of your position. Even angry the troops mentioned take great risk to avoid true collateral damage.

I am stunned that an Australian person can simply divulge this information to the world, and I believe that WikiLeak.org is www trash.

My thoughts on this, The USA have got to go to print and piss on the WikaLeak.org fireworks before they light the fuse.

Words fail me.

Regards ian 2411

For this I can agree with you. The real problem lies in the mixed message from our Government. The White House says "no big deal" the Joint Chief says "big deal". Were you the enemy how would you react?