Hi NatalieD, thankyou for you're reply. I understand there are allot of weird wankers out there and it only makes sense to guard against that.

But to condemn all sub men to total fawning submission when for allot of us it is a sexual thing not a life controlling certainty. And to decide that because there are wankers out there the men you desire will be frozen out of sex and intimacy, just incase they are wankers!!!!!

Anyway I don't think that dodgy perverts is the only reason that Dommes have the "no sex" rule for male subs because many Dommes are quite happy to have sex with dom guys or vanilla men, it's only the subs who are excluded almost universally.

It seems to me that my quote about feminine biology and primal sexuality might have more to say about this than you think.

Also allot of the Dominant women I have talked to never grew up with an urge to dominate guys and have erotic dreams and desires that involve having their sexual partner at their mercy.

Many Dommes I have met where introduced to the bdsm scene later in life and enjoyed the power, the sense of community, the clothes, the equipment, the techniques and the amazing effect that this all has on sub men but sexually they don't fancy sub guys and still look for alpha male between the sheets.

This is not to say that all Dommes are like this, not by a long chalk but there is definitely allot of women on the scene who actually exclude submissive men from sex because they are not sexually attracted to them.

When you said

''I think you don't know very many women. Or maybe you do, but in that case I'm glad I don't know the women you know."

I think you're being unfair, I'm just speculating on why submissive guys exclusively are excluded from sex.

And I think it is a fair point to say that it is probably masculine active sexuality that attracts women to men and seeing that many sub men lack the desire to be active and masculine in bed and don't have wonderful outfits and a sexy femininity to keep the attraction we tend to find that we are marginalized.

It explains it better than just saying there are allot of perverts out there.

Sexual urges are a powerful thing, the sheer number of scary men is not enough to override the sexual urges of submissive females or for that matter Domme women.

It's quite plainly not about men being obsessed by sex and wanting to filter out the dangerous perverted dodgepots. If it was the "no sex" rule would apply across the board to all men as we can see it is reserved to sub men, potentially the least dangerous and worrying of the lot.

I just wish if Dommes don't find sub men attractive and are only are looking for a man to beat and do domestic duties they would be totally honest about it then I can avoid them.

With all due respect to the Dommes out there I think all men should avoid such Dommes because attraction should be essential to all relationships whether they are subDom or vanilla.

Why spend you're life living a lie, better to submit to a woman who finds you attractive and gets turned on by dominating you. The feeling should be mutual.

Or am I being to picky again??? Is this breaking rule number 1!!!!! NO SUB SHALL TOP FROM THE BOTTOM??????

My god what a mine field I never know if I'm saying the wron thing