In my case I've found that its of no use to try and have a discussion with someone who refuses to accept logic unless it supports his own position.
I'm hurt, denuseri! I'm willing to accept logical arguments, I think. But they have to have some basis in reality. And I'm trying really, really hard not to make disparaging remarks about people.
"A casual stroll through the lunatic asylum shows that faith does not prove anything." - Friedrich Nietzsche